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  1. #11
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    Aug 2014
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    I also appreciate the picture, now I can grasp how such a mechanism would work. That's a really neat mortise cylinder.

  2. #12
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    Sep 2014
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    Country: United States

    Default Help with Sargent Union Unit Lock

    Recently discovered this great site!
    We have a Sargent Union (Unit we think) lock that is original to the house (mission style, built in 1915). It's latch is not fully retracting back into the door (@25% of the time) such that our clients are often locked out! How repairable is this lock? One locksmith here in Topeka said it was not repairable. I have not yet attempted to remove the lock from the door. I only found a few similar pictures of Sargent Union locks online as well as the patent. Can a newbie attempt this repair - or am I in over my head?

    Thanks, in advance all.

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  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
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    714
    Country: United States

    Default Sargent Union Lock Co.

    SWIVW
    As lock get older went the last time the lock has been clean out and lubricant. You need to keep checking on finding a good locksmith that can really help you out. Even is mean trying to find some old timer locksmith. I'm sure you could get that lock to work better...Timothy...

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Tonawanda, NY, USA
    Posts
    900
    Country: United States

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by swivw View Post
    Recently discovered this great site!
    We have a Sargent Union (Unit we think) lock that is original to the house (mission style, built in 1915). It's latch is not fully retracting back into the door (@25% of the time) such that our clients are often locked out! How repairable is this lock? One locksmith here in Topeka said it was not repairable. I have not yet attempted to remove the lock from the door. I only found a few similar pictures of Sargent Union locks online as well as the patent. Can a newbie attempt this repair - or am I in over my head? Thanks, in advance all.
    Your installation is unusual in that the lock face doesn't appear to extend for the full thickness of the door. I'm guessing that perhaps the lock was made for a 1-3/4" door but that yours is 2-1/4" thick? The finish carpenter may have modified the cutout to accommodate the lock he had on hand. The pdf template at the link shows a typical unit lock door cutout:
    https://extranet.assaabloydss.com/li...pdf/T30495.PDF
    Your lock should definitely be repairable although it is possible that parts might need to be custom fabricated if extremely worn or broken. It might also only need cleaning, lubrication or spring(s) replacement. In any event, I would leave the repair to an experienced locksmith as these mechanisms can be rather complex.

    Pete Schifferli

  5. #15
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    Sep 2014
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    4
    Country: United States

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pschiffe View Post
    Your installation is unusual in that the lock face doesn't appear to extend for the full thickness of the door. I'm guessing that perhaps the lock was made for a 1-3/4" door but that yours is 2-1/4" thick? The finish carpenter may have modified the cutout to accommodate the lock he had on hand. The pdf template at the link shows a typical unit lock door cutout:
    https://extranet.assaabloydss.com/li...pdf/T30495.PDF
    Your lock should definitely be repairable although it is possible that parts might need to be custom fabricated if extremely worn or broken. It might also only need cleaning, lubrication or spring(s) replacement. In any event, I would leave the repair to an experienced locksmith as these mechanisms can be rather complex.

    Pete Schifferli
    Pete and Timothy: Thanks for the replies!

    The lock was lubricated by the locksmith - but I don't know how far he took it apart.
    The door is 1 3/4" thick, the latch/lock mechanism is 1 7/8" wide. Other Sargent Union lock images I've found online seem to be installed in a similar fashion. Note: http://ogtstore.com/architectural/ha...nze-unit-lock/

    The search is on for an elder locksmith willing to tackle this project.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Seattle WA
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    1,327
    Country: United States

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    Your lock is newer than mine by at least 10 years if you will notice the difference in the latch. As to the repair it will depend on what is wrong. If metal is just worn away then you have a problem. If it is cracked then someone might try brazing but I would say the lock is over its life expectancy already by 20-30 years. So you need to find someone that is good at small metal work. These are not common or come cheap anymore as there are so few in this world of throw away world. Most locksmiths will not make parts anymore.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    87
    Country: United States

    Default Definitely worth repairing

    Quote Originally Posted by swivw View Post
    Pete and Timothy: Thanks for the replies!

    The lock was lubricated by the locksmith - but I don't know how far he took it apart.
    The door is 1 3/4" thick, the latch/lock mechanism is 1 7/8" wide. Other Sargent Union lock images I've found online seem to be installed in a similar fashion. Note: http://ogtstore.com/architectural/ha...nze-unit-lock/

    The search is on for an elder locksmith willing to tackle this project.

    The lock itself is easy to remove--2 screws in the edge of the door & 2 inside that go all the way through to the outside plate. Remove these & separate the two halves of the lock. If you can't determine what's out of order, take it to an old-time locksmith or someone who specializes in antique architectural locks. Sometimes these show up on eBay, but they're expensive. I would definitely avoid the metal plate & modern knob repair route, since it won't be near the look or quality of what you currently have. Unfortunately, as others here have mentioned, the Union lock has not been made for many decades & no modern replacement exists.

  8. #18
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    Sep 2014
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    4
    Country: United States

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    Thanks for the info Yale! I may try that route.
    What do board members think of replacing the strike plate (is that what it's called?) with a thinner substitute. The one in place now is quite thick - the latch when retracted 75% vs 100% might still clear a thinner plate. Of course, it would have to be thick enough so that the dead bolt would still be secure.

    Thoughts?

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Posts
    87
    Country: United States

    Default Your latch is not working properly

    Quote Originally Posted by swivw View Post
    Thanks for the info Yale! I may try that route.
    What do board members think of replacing the strike plate (is that what it's called?) with a thinner substitute. The one in place now is quite thick - the latch when retracted 75% vs 100% might still clear a thinner plate. Of course, it would have to be thick enough so that the dead bolt would still be secure.

    Thoughts?
    If your latch does not retract fully either something internal is worn/broken or jammed. The problem will likely progress until the latch totally fails. Your lock needs attention before this happens. Changing the strike won't fix the problem if this is the case. Besides, I doubt replacement strikes even exist for that lock.

  10. #20
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    Nov 2005
    Location
    Seattle WA
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    1,327
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    There is ONE replacement of this type of lock made today. It might not fit the hole well as the new one is smaller but the quality level is right up there. Most don't want to pay the price of quality. Corbin Russwin UT5200 series of locks will last over 100 years on a house. It lasted 35 years on a high traffic doors in a hospital. But the cylinder hole wouldn't be covered by the new lock as the new lock has the cylinder in the handle. But it is the same or better quality. You might also try to find a Corbin unit lock on ebay as they old ones had larger plates and might cover the hole. Union locks are rare by comparison as they stopped making them about 1920 and were not common then.

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