Victor cannonball lock

[00247]

I recently acquired another Victor cannonball safe at an auction just 15 miles from home.



This safe was made after the 1908 patent which was for the new one piece manganese door with the coarse threads.



Previously, before the 1908 patent, the doors were of a two piece manganese/steel design and had much finer threads. My other Victor is of this design.



The problem with the newly acquired safe is that the door lock is missing, only the dial ring remains. My other safe has a Sargent & Greenleaf lock that has Victor information stamped on the knob of the dial. In another thread about it fellow member riyame offered this information: I believe this is a Series 6840 Fire Proof - Hand Changing model with Dial # 6912. It has a Japanned iron case 4" x 2 7/8" x 1 1/4", 3 number combination and a sliding bolt with a 3/8" throw. But this is information from a 1927 catalog so it might be different than yours.

That info matches the lock in that safe perfectly despite the safe being prior to 1908. Here are a few pictures of that lock. If anyone can confirm the model, please do so.








Back to the missing lock on the "new" Victor. This safe had a different lock. The dial ring is different and it is a key change model as the door and dial ring have a key change hole. It also has a different mounting bolt pattern of 3 1/8" x 2 1/16". Those are the only clues. Could it have been another S&G lock or could Victor have also used Yale? I would assume (dangerous I know) that it would still have Victor markings on the dial knob? Can anyone shed some light on what locks were used on the Victor cannonballs? Also, does anyone know how long the cannonballs were produced?

[Doug MacQueen]

I do not know whether Victor ever used Yale on the later cannonball, but they definitely did use S&G. Unfortunately the missing lock is a real oddball, used specifically on these safes. So not an easy find. It is the front applied key change feature that makes it different. There is some evidence that a smaller dial was supplied to be used only for comb changes. However not having one I made a special change key that can be used with the standard dial that comes with the safe. I should be able to get some pics up here within a few days.

[Huw Eastwood]

Another cracking cannonball and someone had a sense of humour, mounting the wheeled base at 90 degrees so it’ll roll forwards/backwards with the opening/closing action of the door !

[00247]

Thank you for the reply, Doug. I look forward to whatever pictures you may have.I delayed answering because of some developments. A couple days ago a small Martin C. Briggs and Son safe turned up on Facebook Marketplace. I already have a medium (but on the large side) Briggs and Son safe and with how rare they are I knew I had to have this one to compliment the other.








The safe was in the Minneapolis, Minnesota area so I hoped to go there and on up to the Brainard area to check out a lead on a safe dealer with a large stock of old safes and parts. After that, I hoped to check on an acquaintance that has motorcycle parts near Lake Mille Lacs. A nice but long round trip.Picking up the safe went smoothly and an appointment was made with the safe dealer. A large stock of old safes was an understatement. I saw well over 200 of what I would call antique safes and another 50 that were slightly newer. There was another very large building full of more modern to late model safes but there was not enough time to go look at. Dean said he lost count after 500 safes. Better safes are kept for resale, poorer ones are parted out. It is organized for the most part; he knows what he has and where it is at. Maybe with just a little searching. lolThe main item I was looking for was the Sargent and Greenleaf lock for the Victor cannonball. After some discussion about it he didn’t recall ever seeing a front key change on a cannonball, but he had parted out some Victor cannonballs over the years. In a large steel multiple drawer unit that stored locks, we looked through the Victor drawer. A variety of locks but nothing was even close. Then Dean reached over to a table that had overflow, opened up a box, and said here is a Victor lock. My eyes bulged out of my head when I saw it had the black Japaned body as he handed it to me. My jaw dropped when I pulled the rear cover and saw a key change wheel pack. I damn near crapped my pants when I flipped it over and saw the removable dial and the front key change hole. I could not believe it, the exact lock I thought I would never find. Can anyone identify the model?









If the lock was here, surely there must be more Victor parts. On the search we went and found a Victor cannonball rear door plate with the patent tag still in place and the surround frame for the time lock, and on a shelf was a Victor inner rear door piece with the Bankers Dustproof time lock (rough condition) and most of the door lock linkage. A crank for a Mosler screw door safe was also found. I would have liked to have looked more but time ran short. The one thing I didn't find was the bolt extension slide that connects the lock to the gate on the drive gear for turning the door on the Victor. I can make one on the mill as even if it is found it may not fit as they are hand fit to each safe. A fair deal was made on everything and I was on my way. I also hooked up with the motorcycle parts and headed home completing a long but very satisfying trip. I’m already planning a return trip to the safe dealer to do some more looking.

[00247]

Not sure why the picture and paragraph spacing got messed up upon submitting. Perhaps a moderator can correct it? There should be a new paragraph after each period where there is no space behind it. The edit feature really should be longer than 10 minutes.