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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    Devon UK
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    Country: UK

    Default Chatwood records

    The Chatwood records at The History of Locks Museum are a revelation!
    Brian kindly let me peruse some of them (until the night got too late) and I can see many hours of study ahead.
    Everything from the wartime factory rules to ancient directors committee records, production records, pricing and profit calculations, blueprints, financial records, dating ledgers including many of the "missing years"….a treasure trove for old-lock anoraks and historians.
    I was interested to see that two safes were made for Woolworths, one with a key and one with a key and combination but I have never come across a mention of them, let alone an actual one – has anyone else seen one?
    There were also a number of safes which never showed up in any of the sales catalogues which I own – homesafes and wallsafes (by Chatwood rather than the Chatwood Milner wallsafes) and sawdust safes (right up to WW2).
    Seeing what a large proportion of their later safes sold were the Duplex was extraordinary, but the profit margins were big which allowed 14% dividends plus BIG directors remuneration - cash transactions ?!?

    All in all, the records were enormously illuminating and the blueprints will be a godsend where replacement parts are needing to be produced for renovations.

  2. #2
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    Aug 2013
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    Country: Wales

    Default

    Very good Tom, kid in sweet shop springs to mind! Interesting about the two safes made for Woolworths, presumably specials or one-offs? Not linked in any way, but coincidentally the earliest Manifoils I ever saw out in the field were in a Woolworths on Duplex Majors in a small valleys town.

  3. #3
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Huw Eastwood View Post
    Very good Tom, kid in sweet shop springs to mind! Interesting about the two safes made for Woolworths, presumably specials or one-offs? Not linked in any way, but coincidentally the earliest Manifoils I ever saw out in the field were in a Woolworths on Duplex Majors in a small valleys town.
    The records show that they only made a tiny proportion with the combo and as they were unlikely to want to pay for a sarupticious entry proof lock, I am guessing that it was a secondhand safe they had acquired, but it would have been a sensible choice of product for Chatwood to use as the basis for a “special”

  4. #4
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    Apr 2019
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    Default

    Great stuff

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    Bournemouth, UK
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    Default

    Glad you enjoyed it Tom, you have seen the scope of the material, there is also a large amount of Milner material as well, to say nothing of when the two companies merged; in all there must now be well over 150 volumes and several box files relating to Milner, Chatwood and Catwood Milner. Far to much to put on line but have started with extracts or tasters from the Milner Board meetings; see separate thread: Milners Safe Company Limited Minute Books.

    Chatwood, as most know, had their own railway siding. The agreement with the railway company was renewed each year. When the two companies merged the railway company got confused, Chatwood-Milner had to write a letter to clarify the name changes. In so doing the sequence of events relating to the merger is also clarified. There are lots of snippets like this that clarify, illuminate and inform.

    Hopefully we will see more of you and others to pursue the Archive volumes and make further discoveries and observations.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
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    Aberdeenshire
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    Country: Great Britain

    Default

    [QUOTE=Tom Gordon;31010]The Chatwood records at The History of Locks Museum are a revelation!

    There were also a number of safes which never showed up in any of the sales catalogues which I own – homesafes and wallsafes (by Chatwood rather than the Chatwood Milner wallsafes) and sawdust safes (right up to WW2).


    Tom, hoping to hear a lot more from these records in the future. As regards these mysterious home safes, all I can suggest is the Texagen, the little black all concrete cast bodied safe with a continuous hinge plus a dummy on the other side. It had a white plastic handle and escutcheon and the front face of the body was slightly tapered. Sorry but no other illustrations.

    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	21316 I knew of a larger version which was constructed on the same principal and which may have been the Household. I also learned that Chatwood made a special safe for the Times Furnishing Company before the war which may in fact be the same safe.

    I think I may have mentioned this before but have you any knowledge of the Citadel Safe as below. I seem to recollect but cannot substantiate that when Samuel Chatwood and his son relinquished their seats on the Board in 1907 they setup a separate company as shown below, but who was G Chatwood?

    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	21317 Look forward to hearing if you can throw any light on this.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    Devon UK
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    Default

    [QUOTE=safeman;31077]
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Gordon View Post
    The Chatwood records at The History of Locks Museum are a revelation!

    There were also a number of safes which never showed up in any of the sales catalogues which I own – homesafes and wallsafes (by Chatwood rather than the Chatwood Milner wallsafes) and sawdust safes (right up to WW2).


    Tom, hoping to hear a lot more from these records in the future. As regards these mysterious home safes, all I can suggest is the Texagen, the little black all concrete cast bodied safe with a continuous hinge plus a dummy on the other side. It had a white plastic handle and escutcheon and the front face of the body was slightly tapered. Sorry but no other illustrations.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Chat.Texagen.2.JPG 
Views:	14 
Size:	76.3 KB 
ID:	21314 Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Stratford Cashier '79 Levys (4).jpg 
Views:	15 
Size:	949.8 KB 
ID:	21315 Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Chatwood patent.jpg 
Views:	8 
Size:	37.5 KB 
ID:	21316 I knew of a larger version which was constructed on the same principal and which may have been the Household. I also learned that Chatwood made a special safe for the Times Furnishing Company before the war which may in fact be the same safe.

    I think I may have mentioned this before but have you any knowledge of the Citadel Safe as below. I seem to recollect but cannot substantiate that when Samuel Chatwood and his son relinquished their seats on the Board in 1907 they setup a separate company as shown below, but who was G Chatwood?

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Chatwood Citadel_edited-1.jpg 
Views:	13 
Size:	205.0 KB 
ID:	21317 Look forward to hearing if you can throw any light on this.
    I do look forward to finding some of these smaller safes sometime and they sold quite a few!
    when I am looking through the directors minutes, I will keep an eye open for how they dealt with a Chatwood in competition.
    I would be surprised if the Texagen was the same as the “Household” because That wouldn’t be a nickname like the “bomb” and so should show up separately in the company records.

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