Welcome to our world exploring the Historical, Political and Technological aspects of Locks, Keys and Safes

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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
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    Bulgaria
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    686
    Country: Bulgaria

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    That is a job of which to be proud!

  2. #52
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Wisconsin
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    147
    Country: United States

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve48 View Post
    I do have issues with the Nanny state, because it doesn't matter what laws they pass, only the law abiding abide by them.
    Amen! I would love to go on a political rant but I will refrain. While I am fond of my restored safes, I cherish my AR-15 and it's compadres.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Devon UK
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    3,117
    Country: UK

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    Quote Originally Posted by 00247 View Post
    Amen! I would love to go on a political rant but I will refrain. While I am fond of my restored safes, I cherish my AR-15 and it's compadres.
    Once soon a time I was a stripper! This is the first I have heard about the EU taking the most effective paint strippers away from us.
    The remaining ones are caustic soda based (Sodium Hydroxide).
    it is a bit better to use caustic potash (potassium hydroxide) although it is not widely available and not the same as methyl dichloride. Remaining traces can be neutralised after use with vinegar.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Central England
    Posts
    93
    Country: England

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warren63 View Post
    Hi all, has anyone got any idea what this Cotterill part is from? It says Edwin Cotterill patent paragon spring I think.
    Corkscrew?

  5. #55
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Central England
    Posts
    93
    Country: England

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    Whitfield from yesterday, single action boltwork and no curtain in the lock but externally looked very similar to the "City"
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Image7753017393438198236.jpg  

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Central England
    Posts
    93
    Country: England

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    Good find your safe there, lovely example and a fantastic restoration job

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Aberdeenshire
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    697
    Country: Great Britain

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    [QUOTE=Steve48;292
    This thread will now await completion of the painting of the body, so although this could take a while, I as someone once said will be back. But I will of course respond to any comments or questions in the meantime.

    Steve, just a few loose ends.

    Date of manufacture. I now believe that I was misled by the way the body was put together and go along with sometime after 1885. I suppose it could have been that as safes were only part of the business it would not have been practical to lay out on heavy plant capable of shaping the heavy plate that they used and resorted to blacksmithing.

    Fred took over on his father's death in the 1880's and certainly aimed high in burglar-resistant quality as we see in your safe. I mentioned Cotterill locks previously but it appears they were only used in the 1850's being replaced with the superior Mappin lock around 1867. Being of the slider type with a very small keyway they provided protection against the use of gunpowder. Your 'City Safe' with a lever lock follows in this tradition as it is very similar to the Milner Powder-Proof Lock of 1854 which reduced the charge of powder by means of the iron block casting which filled all the space not required in the operation of the key and levers. In fact it bears many resemblances to the Milner lock such as the gatings in the ends of the levers and the double keyhole dispensing with the need for the key to travel a full revolution and the space required to accommodate it.

    I'm now tempted to believe that this lock was designed for Whitfield by Milners locksmiths and possibly manufactured by Bramah in London which in turn may connect to the name "The City Safe" for prestigeous reasons. The Whitfield Safe & Door Co, in the following years included London in their address. The company was bought by Milners in 1960.

    You're doing the safe proud Steve.

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
    Location
    Bulgaria
    Posts
    686
    Country: Bulgaria

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    I sometimes wonder why they didn't keep the keyway to extract the key solid. That way they would have had a key retaining lock, which would have been superior. Possibly at that stage nobody had thought of having a key retaining system.

    It really is a lovely action. I would add a single dead AED, but I realise that you want to keep it all original.

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Bransgore
    Posts
    45
    Country: England

    Default Good evening all

    First let me say thank you to all and those kind words. My knowledge of safes could be written on a postcard so the knowledge I have gained from you all has been most helpful.

    Safeman: I think you raise a very valid point regarding blacksmithing, the previous two generations to me were just that. Plus thinking also of traction engines and their ilk, the type of construction, ie dovetails and rivets is not of a different time period to the late 1880's even though there were obvious progresses before this date, and yes it comes down to capital expenditure and if it was justifiable.

    The origin of the lock is an interesting point and I see no reason why it wouldn't have been bought in. In fact during this era a lot of specialists did just that, one only has to look at clocks during this period to see that there were lots of outworkers doing one specific task.

    And, yes by this time they Whitfield were in London as well as their home ground in Birmingham, two cities which at that time were a bustle of activity, however although I tend by association to think of London as The City, there is no means of connecting this safe to London any more than to Birmingham, unless of course someone finds some paperwork one day.

    Chubby: Yes it is my intention to return this safe to how it came out of the factory, maybe in some small ways it will be better painted, but no intention to modify it. However again I must add I do not know some of the terminology quoted and AED is lost on me.

    Tom: Whilst I truly do blame the EU for a great many undesirable things that have taken place in our country. I am not so sure that the restrictions on chemicals have all been from Brussels, rather more inclined to think they have come from our own. Namely the HSE and our Government in connection with violence carried out here, and of course A&E treatments at hospitals are again recorded and acted upon. But either way it is typical that a few spoil things for the many.

    Regarding strippers, of the non female type. I am very reticent about using them anyway, however some are quite viscous and those to my mind are suited, because anything runny will end up in places where you cannot remove it and possibly never neutralise it. This is especially true of safes, because you cannot dismantle them, also of old castings that have blow holes or sand pockets. Which is why I took my safe for a walk in the garden and attacked it in all accessible places with a power tool. The internals were simply impossible that way, so a thick paint stripper was used, I could have scraped it out but it is lead paint and that is a no no in my book. Outside full PPE was the order of the day.

    Sadly I am still not one hundred percent recovered from my grandchildren's virus, but I have now rust treat the exterior of the 'lump' bar the top, need to fettle some of the inside before I can really get to grips with some painting.

    Steve

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Posts
    266
    Country: Germany

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    AED is an "anti-explosion device" aka relocker. It is a device which blocks the bolt work when safe is attacked by brute force.

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