Pillard combo lock

[odinfix]

Sorry, that is a decorative top corner detail. The bolt handle pic won't upload. I'll have to lower rez on my phone cam and retake some detail pics of the safe. Meantime, anyone out there fmailiar with / have hands-on experience with these Locks?

Thanks

[David Hovey]

Sorry, that is a decorative top corner detail. The bolt handle pic won't upload. I'll have to lower rez on my phone cam and retake some detail pics of the safe. Meantime, anyone out there fmailiar with / have hands-on experience with these Locks?

Thanks

R4 times to 1st#
L3 times to 2nd#
R2 times to 3rd#
L to stop.

DH

[odinfix]

Thanks for the info David.
I've tried that sequence a couple times this morning, but no dice so far.

My father had written it down:
5xL - 1st #
2xR - 2nd#
1xL - 3rd#

Which obviously wasn't working. I know when I DID get it to open the One time, weeks ago, I was experimenting with # of turns BOTH ways (LRL and RLR) - so it very much COULD have been RLR (as you said) that worked for me that once.

I'm trying, as You advised:
4xR to 1st # (Passing "0" 4x, and stopping on 1st#)
3xL to 2nd# (Passing 1st# 3x, and stopping on 2nd#)
2xR to 3rd# (Passing 2nd# 2x, and stopping on 3rd#)
Slowly turning Dial back to L (Listening for click & feeling for dial stop)

I've also tried / incorporated:
- The above exact sequence reversed (LRLR)
- Doing both of the above sequences while jiggling the door and/or bolt handle while giving the final (drop) dial turn, and also tried shimming the door with folded paper to put slight inward pressure to create a neutral hang, should anything be leaning outward against it from the inside.
- Pre-rotate dial in direction opposite of 1st sequence turn, a minimum of 4 times before starting sequence

No luck so far.

Very frustrating, as I KNOW the numbers work - otherwise it wouldn't have opened once.
I feel like there must be SOMEthing very simple I'm overlooking.

Any ideas what I could be doing wrong, or something I've misread? Does anyone out there have a Pillards No 19 to try / confirm the turn sequence on, etc?

Thank you in advance for any assistance.

[Yankee]

You may a dialing wrong by the looks...

Dial like this:
Left 4 times to your first number.
Right two times past your second number, stoping the third time up.
Left one time past your third number stoping the second time up.
Right slowly until the dial comes to a stop, around 95.

[odinfix]

Thanks Yankee.

I've just tried your sequence as well ( both L-R-L-R and R-L-R-L), but still no joy.

I had previously tried every variation I could think of, had read about, etc (4x3x2x - turn for drop, passing 0 as first ref point, passing the first , then second, third, #'s as their own discrete reference points, both directions, etc), using every variation that I could think of - but still no joy. I'm turning super slow, medium speed, you name it. I make sure the door is hanging neutral, I jiggle the bolt handle,....I've even gotten down to listen with a stethoscope on the door, listening for noises - all to no avail.

I can't for the life of me figure out WHICH variation / sequence I used when I opened it the One time. (And HOW many times I've kicked myself since!!! )

I was hoping someone out there might ideally have one of these locks, and be willing to test / confirm the EXACT sequence for me, (using their own combo & lock, obviously), or have some first hand knowledge thereof.

The lock MAY have something stuck mechanically ( although it seems unlikely that it would have somehow jammed or stuck in the last few weeks, after oh...a hundred years lol..but ..Murphy is strong against me, it seems ) and if I could KNOW the exact sequence for SURE, and HAVE the numbers..I'll be able to test repeatedly to open it...or know for sure it's just beating my head against a very old door lol.

As it is, I'm just scratching my head and more than a bit frustrated. LoL

Anyone out there have one of these (No 19 Pillards) to test?

Thanks again to everyone who's responded so far. Much appreciated.

[David Hovey]

The normal dialing sequence is as I posted before. The lock drops in and opens to the left. With that said, and working backwards a 3 wheel lock such as yours dials accordingly; R,L,R,L.

I'm trying, as You advised:
4xR to 1st # (Passing "0" 4x, and stopping on 1st#)
3xL to 2nd# (Passing 1st# 3x, and stopping on 2nd#)
2xR to 3rd# (Passing 2nd# 2x, and stopping on 3rd#)
Slowly turning Dial back to L (Listening for click & feeling for dial stop)

Your above sequence (in other words) works out to be this;
R5 times to 1st#
L4 times to 2nd#
R3 times to 3rd#
L to stop.
Which is incorrect.

Forget about the zero it has nothing to do with the lock operation unless one of your combination numbers is zero. Forget about passing any numbers. More correctly think of just going to your numbers. The first time you go to your number it will not be a complete revolution of the dial. Understand?

Have you seen patent 114706?

DH

[Yankee]

So you got me thinking...I dug out my pillard #17 lock that should be similar to his 19.
The lock has three wheels and a driver.

The correct dialing sequence is:
Right 4x to first number
Left 3x to the second number
Right 2x to the third number
Left to 100~ dial comes to a stop.

This lock is very susceptible to bolt pressure. Make sure that the boltwork handle is in the fully locked position.
I have more Pillards in my collection. .....I'll post more soon.

[odinfix]

Thanks so much everyone!


I should have explained more fully from the start, but didn't want to tediously list Every variant way of dialing I've tried, including what everyone has suggested.

Before my initial posts, I'd ALSO gone thru each L-R-L_R and R-L-R_L variant with my numbers (Starting at both 0 on the dial/index line AND Starting from the 1st #, etc)...and then
1) proceeding (exactly as advised) from each # onward, ignoring the last #, ignoring 0 ,
2) proceeding using the last # passed to count the revolutions and stopping on the next#,
3) adding / reducing each number of revolutions for each # IN the sequence (starting 5x4x4x, 5x4x3x, 5x4x2, 5x3x3, 5x3x2, etc....4x4x4, 4x4x3, 4x4x2, 4x3x3, 4x3x2, etc..thru 3x3x3, 3x3x2...and so forth), using both of the above methods (and anything else I could think of / try) for both L-R-L_R and R-L-R_L sequences,
and basically every other thing i came across.

I'd gone at this logically, methodically, and with common sense to that point. That's why, when I began posting, I set ego 100% aside - to ask for ANY firsthand knowledge of, or ideally access to (enabling a hard test to 100% eliminate any and all other sequence variants once and for all) of a Pillards N0 19 combination lock.
I appreciate ANY help, and I'm trying it ALL as I receive it - even if I've tried those same methods a hundred times - in the hopes that I can eliminate at least some of the variables in this process.

I have tried about every method I could scour up on the net, and cannot get the safe to open again.. and yet: it Did- ONCE, with the numbers I have. Otherwise I would simply think the NUMBERS were incorrect at this point. Thus, you can see my frustration. LoL

SO: I thank you for your continued patience with me folks.
I truly DO appreciate Any and All assistance, advice, options, suggestions, or guesses - and I DO try any tip I receive - regardless of whether or not I've tried that exact method previously.

My father left me these safes when he passed away just 2 months ago and so perhaps they are, in a way, one of the last Tasks I can do with / for him. It's kind of important to me.

So I sincerely do thank Everyone for their continued help, once again. Keep em comin.

[eddiecharette]