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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
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    72
    Country: Italy

    Default Old castell padlock pat n 430168

    20160609 214305 zpspcd4u2jv 1

    20160609 223739 zps3mivmiwe 1

    I got this nice padlock some time ago and was going to make a key for it.

    I found a key cut quite shallow that seemed a bit too big but could fit. Filed it until it entered the keyway. Then I blackened it with a candle and tried to impression it. Got not much luck because I couldn't find a way to put pressure to the pins to leave marks. Pulling the lock apart with my fingers was not enough, and I don't want to ruin this beauty so I'm not going to force it with tools that could leave marks. Does anybody have some hints on how to impression it?

    I shimmed it open and analyzed the pins. The bittings seems very similar to a couple keys I found with an online search. The first pin long, the second one very short and the last two almost the same length as the first one. Is this padlock part of a big master key system?

    Thanks :)

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
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    1,755
    Country: Wales

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    that one had me guessing for a minute as 'castell' is Welsh for castle- interesting padlock and a name I hadn't heard of before.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    714
    Country: United States

    Default Old castell padlock pat n 430168

    Nice Lock. This look like to me almost like all the push key padlock (Yale Model 803, 805 and other padlock). Look like you need to push pressure on the lock as per drawing A & B. Maybe using a rope or something to pull on the lock A & B to impression the key. I remember long time ago a guy came up a tool to pull the shackle while trying to pick the lock or impression the key also using a rope. Keep this in mind only use so much pressure to do this. I attached the PDF....Timothy....
    Attached Files Attached Files

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    714
    Country: United States

    Default Old castell padlock pat n 430168

    I was just thinking if you have some kind of small wood wedge to put between the lock part to add pressure to pull apart....Timothy...

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    72
    Country: Italy

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    MaxVaultage, castello means castle in italian. Our languages do share something after all.

    Timothy, thanks a lot for the patent, I couldn't find it myself. I'll try some rope or some wooden wedges and see what happens.

    Cheers :)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    102
    Country: Canada

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    I had one of those for a short period several years ago. They are a zipper/briefcase lock. Not sure how you would tension it though.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Location
    Cyberspace
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    Country: Australia

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    Also used on coin operated Gas / Electric meters.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    72
    Country: Italy

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    This padlock had many uses, but mine, as you can see in the first picture of this thread, had a funny looking thing attached to it. I think it was used to lock postal sacks.

    20160621 213030 zpsttnqd4i9 1


    I got a couple YA6 blanks and filed down one to fit the keyway. I had to file it on top and bottom, but fortunately I hadn't to fiddle with the wardings because they matches.


    20160621 212952 zpsxwwwarp4 1


    Here is my first failed attempt with an old key and the new blank just filed.


    20160621 213145 zpsqwcyyjt9 1


    And here are the pin impressions. I'm impressed (pun intended) on how good they are.
    I've sanded the key smooth with 400 grit sandpaper, inserted in the padlock and wiggled left and right while trying to pull the lock apart with my fingers. I really don't want to ruin this padlock so I'm taking my time and working carefully.
    I'll scrape some lines along the pin positions on the key side so I can follow them while filing.
    I'll finish this key as soon as I have some free time.


    A warning if you shim these padlocks: the first two pins will fly away when you open it. Keep the shim down while opening the lock.
    If it happens, don't move the lock, look for the pins and insert them again. The pin stacks are balanced so be sure to put the correct pin in its chamber.


    Cheers :)

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    72
    Country: Italy

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    After a lot of filing I got the key that opened the lock.


    20160623 224626 zpso6xoki68 1


    20160623 224432 zpsnmwfkxlx 1


    20160623 224351 zps870aenpu 1


    I was very happy and excited and had time to take the pictures you see above before closing the padlock again.


    Then I felt something small falling. One pin was on the floor and another one was on the table. Now I know why the original key has such a weird looking flat part between the bittings and the bow.
    I had to think for a few minutes to understand why the bottom pins of chamber 1 and 2 fell off and to find a way to put them back where they belonged.
    I closed the padlock, removed the key and shimmed it open again. I kept the padlock upside down so the top pins in chamber 1 and 2 were sitting in the plug and not in the lock body. I could then open it and insert the bottom pins back in their chambers. If it wasn't possible to shim it I could have broken it at least three times already.


    I need to solder something on the bottom of this key to fill the gap between it and the plug. Now that I know it has this defect I can use it alongside with a pick, so the pins can't fly out again. Or I can find a proper key blank and copy the bittings to that blank.


    20160623 223924 zpszjmxzisf 1


    Comparing the old key I tried to impression earlier with the working one, I see I may still make it work. Looks like I just need to make some cuts deeper. It's strange that I stopped getting marks.


    20160623 224559 zpslhwesxjo 1


    20160623 224521 zpseqmkgzul 1


    Finally the padlock has its strage hasp on again and its working key.


    20160623 224921 zpse2ymtykj 1


    Cheers :)

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    714
    Country: United States

    Default Old castell padlock pat n 430168

    WOW! I knew you will get it one way or another good job....Timothy.....

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