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  1. #11
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    Jan 2010
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    this could well be it though similar its not quite the same the one in photo looks far studier than my one perhaps there was more than one version of it pity we haven't the proper sizes

  2. #12
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    Oct 2009
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    Cleveland, Ohio USA
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    Of course, another obscure internally indirect drive English combination lock. Thank you Patent, sure didn't see that one coming. Well Max, I guess we're both guilty of not thinking outside the box, both making the natural assumption that it must be a keylock. I feel especially bad given the fact that I have an apparently slightly less obscure Chatwood SAM combination lock sitting on the chair nearby. Here are a couple pictures and one of an earlier MacNeale Urban Excelsior lock.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Chatwood SAM.jpg   SAM.jpg   MacNeale Urban Excelsior.JPG  

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
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    1,754
    Country: Wales

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    Yes totally agree Doug, yet another big thanks to Patent, I had no idea that was coming either- not so much 'barking up the wrong tree', as 'in the wrong forest' with that one!

    Patent was one of the members who I thought might have one, the photos and patent drawing are a big step forward on a lock that i didn't even know existed- and what a beautiful lock it is- love that conical banded dial, so thanks again Patent.

    Doug your Chatwood SAM is amazing, in 30 years I never encountered any of the 'exotic' Chatwood locks, did see a few of Chris Taylor's chatwood's a long time ago, that was as close as I got to the 'pork pies' and combinations.
    Always amazing to see how much brass and phosphor bronze went into those back then.
    Which always makes me think how many zinc die-cast LaGard Combogards will be around in 100 years...

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Aberdeenshire
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    697
    Country: Great Britain

    Default Ratner Lock.

    Wandering off subject slightly I attach a photograph of a Ratner Grade 7 from 1925 fitted with the 'Combo' Lock.

    From the first Tann Museum this is similar but slightly more detailed than the colour photo in the website Museum version.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	First Museum section.jpg 
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ID:	15588 Also more clearly shown are the demo Ratner LeeMatic board and a Chatwood Composite lock

    used to demonstrate the multiple actions in the Diamond Safe. Attached is a photo of the LeeMatic system as fitted

    (Grade unknown but probably 'Y' Quality or above).

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Ratner LeeMatic.jpg 
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ID:	15589 The Patent No. 936155 dates from 1960 which almost coincides with Chubb's more complicated version of

    an Isolator Boltwork.

  5. #15
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    Aug 2013
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    Knock me sideways again, the times I've seen the old museum pictures of the big Ratner on your site safeman, yet I'd totally forgotten it had that conical dial. Beautiful safe, would really like to have seen it.

    Whos that in the background, the young and suave playboy character fiddling with the demo board... ;-)

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    Devon UK
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    "Doug your Chatwood SAM is amazing, in 30 years I never encountered any of the 'exotic' Chatwood locks, did see a few of Chris Taylor's chatwood's a long time ago."
    Well Max , it isnt too far down the M5 if you want to see a number of Chatwood's that Chris had never even heard of!
    I have always called that Chatwood lock ontop of the safe in the museum, a fanlock (due to some of its levers being as big as a fan. Surely "composite " referred to having a coffer inner safe?

  7. #17
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    Sep 2007
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    Aberdeenshire
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaxVaultage View Post
    Knock me sideways again, the times I've seen the old museum pictures of the big Ratner on your site safeman, yet I'd totally forgotten it had that conical dial. Beautiful safe, would really like to have seen it.

    Whos that in the background, the young and suave playboy character fiddling with the demo board... ;-)

    Haven't a clue Max. Never fitted that description and nothing like the person whose face I shakily shaved this morning.

  8. #18
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    Sep 2007
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    Aberdeenshire
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Gordon View Post
    "Doug your Chatwood SAM is amazing, in 30 years I never encountered any of the 'exotic' Chatwood locks, did see a few of Chris Taylor's chatwood's a long time ago."
    Well Max , it isnt too far down the M5 if you want to see a number of Chatwood's that Chris had never even heard of!
    I have always called that Chatwood lock ontop of the safe in the museum, a fanlock (due to some of its levers being as big as a fan. Surely "composite " referred to having a coffer inner safe?
    Of course you're dead right Tom about 'composite' having been used to describe a Chatwood safe as fitted with a coffer.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The term has also been used to describe the locking system on the Diamond.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    It can also be called the 'hernia' lock when trying to lift it up on top of the safe although the first of my four inguinals were caused by
    other means, all related to safes of course.

  9. #19
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    Aug 2013
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Gordon View Post
    Well Max , it isnt too far down the M5 if you want to see a number of Chatwood's that Chris had never even heard of!
    I have always called that Chatwood lock ontop of the safe in the museum, a fanlock (due to some of its levers being as big as a fan. Surely "composite " referred to having a coffer inner safe?
    Cheers Tom, when I'm next down that way I sure will let you know, it's probably 10 years or more since I was last down there, the Jurassic coast sure is a beautiful part of the country.

    Ref: the Chatwood coffers, I have a few later brochures which shows their continuation well- through Chatwood-Milner days and Chubb's to its final development as the stand alone Castelle safe.
    I'll dig them out and start another thread so that this can stay on topic with Ant's lock.

  10. #20
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    Sep 2004
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    Devon UK
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    The term has also been used to describe the locking system on the Diamond.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Chatwood Diamond  page 26.jpg 
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ID:	15591
    That seems to suggest a full blown keylock as the escutcheon lock, with the "composite" keylock behind it...

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