Trying open an old safe - Kelly Mfg. Co.

[TCMGO]

Howdy,

I found your forum online. I am trying to help a friend open his old safe, but having no luck. I cannot even find this safe online. It's an old Kelly Mfg Co. floor safe on wheels. What baffles me is the combination, which is written down on an old business card he keeps in his wallet. He says he has opened hundreds of times, but now he cannot open it. I'm trying to find out what group lock number it has and how many numbers its combination is suppose to have. Here is how it is written down:

R 3 - 41
L 2 - 76
R 1 - 47
L - 88
R - 74
90

I am not sure what the 90 is about, as there are no instructions with it? I have tried a number of combinations of these numbers, but just cannot get it. Can you tell me anything about this safe and its combination?

Thanks

Thomas McConnell

[Arcade Al]

It would help a lot to have a photo, in order to identify the manufacturer and type of the combination lock fitted...

[TCMGO]

Here are few photos. The safe is app. 18x18x30

[peerless]

Hi,

What's unusual about the safe is the dial has the handle attached to it, the only manufacturer that comes to mind with that design is Victor Safe Co. Assuming it is indeed a Victor lock, try the following:

(Dial S-L-O-W-L-Y!!!, each time the target number shows up at the dialing index counts as ONE time, even if only a partial revoloution was turned. I can't stress enough how many safe lock "Problems" are due to OVER or UNDER dialing) (Once a number is dialed the proper number of times to the index - FUGGATTABOUTTITT! go on to the NEXT number, if you pass a number by more than 3/4 of a number, you most likely went too far and should start the whole sequence again from the beginning!) (Right=Clockwise, Left=Counterclockwise - It's like driving a car, but unlike a car if you make a mistake you wont go into a ditch and hit a tree [smile] )

Try this:

Turn RIGHT 3 times to 41
Turn LEFT 2 times to 76
Turn RIGHT 1 time to 47
Turn LEFT 1 time to 88
Turn RIGHT to open - Anything happen?


Alternate try:

Turn RIGHT 4 times to 41
Turn LEFT 3 times to 76
Turn RIGHT 2 times to 47
Turn LEFT 1 time to 88
Turn RIGHT until 74 is on the index and continue turning right - anything happen?


If neither of these sequences open the safe, it may be due to a sticking part inside the lockcase as gravity is employed in opening the lock, if the part is sticking, gravity isn't strong enough to drop it into position. It may also be possible the numbers aren't correct for the safe. BTW, what state/area are you?

Hope this helps / Please update...

[TCMGO]

I will try these combinations, being careful to follow your instructions. I live in the fine state of Missouri. thanks

[Doug MacQueen]

Peerless, initially Victor was my first guess, but the dial bar is distinctive of Chicago Safe and Lock. Similar to Victor with the gravity drop but it is a 4 wheel plus driver lock. Normal dialing would be 5R-4L-3R-2L-1R but reverse would give 5L-4R-3L-2R-1L-1R. The reverse would allow for the 6 numbers given but doesn't seem to make sense as the drop in to the stop would be too large of a turn. Doug

[wylk]

The alleged combination suggests a 4-wheel lock but it looks like a fairly ordinary floor safe. Isn't that kind of unusual?

[wylk]

FWIW the patent date on the knob would seem to correspond to US patent 390,528 which was assigned to Victor.

[Doug MacQueen]

Yes, the patent date is a mystery, which will be answered once the lock is pictured, if it is pictured. The Chicago lock uses the same type of wheels found in Hall Premier locks. Regarding the use of 4 wheels, it was not common in the smaller lighter fire safes, but not so unusual in the larger heavier models. There are still lots of Yale 4 wheelers out there even today. Doug

[Brian Smith]

Hey Folks, it looks to me like a three wheel combination, read up by someone who was trying to compensate for a sticky fly or a floating wheel. I recommend dialing the first three numbers as written, slowly as already advised, but on the fourth turn, from about ten #s before 88 give the dial a little wiggle. If it doesn't drop in, redial, each time stopping two #s closer to 88 and repeating the process. There is probably more to it than this, but it gets a little more complicated to explain. I'm in Missouri too, so if needed I can help. Let me know.