Yale & Towne Cast Bronze Pin-tumbler Padlocks - 800 Series Models - Manufacture Date?

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09-07-19, 04:58 AM
Iowa Tom L

Yale & Towne Cast Bronze Pin-tumbler Padlocks - 800 Series Models - Manufacture Date?

I am wondering if anyone knows when Yale started producing their cast bronze, pin-tumbler padlocks of the 800 Series (such as the 830, 840, 850, etc. models)?

I can find them in the 1908 Yale catalog but not in the 1893 catalog (I do not have any catalogs for years in between these). I have looked for patents and searched this forum unsuccessfully for an answer.

Based on their build characteristics, I am guessing that they started being manufactured sometime after January 1901 when the patent application for the locking of the heel and toe of the shackle was filed (Patent #US685289) and before the spring of 1908 when the catalog was published. The Yale Paracentric key with the round bow and Y&T trefoil design (Patent #USD29786) seems to be the earliest key design associated with this series of padlocks.

If someone on this forum could help me find the answer to this question I would appreciate it.

Thank You,

Tom
09-07-19, 04:24 PM
Pschiffe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iowa Tom L

I am wondering if anyone knows when Yale started producing their cast bronze, pin-tumbler padlocks of the 800 Series (such as the 830, 840, 850, etc. models)?

I can find them in the 1908 Yale catalog but not in the 1893 catalog (I do not have any catalogs for years in between these). I have looked for patents and searched this forum unsuccessfully for an answer.

Based on their build characteristics, I am guessing that they started being manufactured sometime after January 1901 when the patent application for the locking of the heel and toe of the shackle was filed (Patent #US685289) and before the spring of 1908 when the catalog was published. The Yale Paracentric key with the round bow and Y&T trefoil design (Patent #USD29786) seems to be the earliest key design associated with this series of padlocks.

If someone on this forum could help me find the answer to this question I would appreciate it.

Thank You,

Tom

The paracentric key is said to have been introduced in 1892 if that helps any. One source mentions 1904 as the date by which all Yale cylinder locks had the new paracentric keys.

Pete Schifferli
15-07-19, 02:56 AM
YALE7750

Earliest 850 style locks...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iowa Tom L

I am wondering if anyone knows when Yale started producing their cast bronze, pin-tumbler padlocks of the 800 Series (such as the 830, 840, 850, etc. models)?

I can find them in the 1908 Yale catalog but not in the 1893 catalog (I do not have any catalogs for years in between these). I have looked for patents and searched this forum unsuccessfully for an answer.

Based on their build characteristics, I am guessing that they started being manufactured sometime after January 1901 when the patent application for the locking of the heel and toe of the shackle was filed (Patent #US685289) and before the spring of 1908 when the catalog was published. The Yale Paracentric key with the round bow and Y&T trefoil design (Patent #USD29786) seems to be the earliest key design associated with this series of padlocks.

If someone on this forum could help me find the answer to this question I would appreciate it.

Thank You,

Tom

The oldest example of this lock type that I have has the following imprinted into the top where it normally says “super pin tumbler”: “PATENTED AUG 11, 1891, SEPT 8, 1896, OTHERS PENDING”.
16-07-19, 01:35 AM
Iowa Tom L

1 Attachment(s)

Yale 800 Series Padlocks with Patent Dates Stamped the Top

Quote:

Originally Posted by YALE7750

The oldest example of this lock type that I have has the following imprinted into the top where it normally says “super pin tumbler”: “PATENTED AUG 11, 1891, SEPT 8, 1896, OTHERS PENDING”.

That is one of the reasons that I started this thread; I am interested in finding out the year that Y&T began this series and if those locks with the "Patented..." information represent the oldest variation of this series.

If someone knew the year that manufacture began for this series then I thought I could concentrate a search for a Yale catalog and print ads as close to that year as possible to help answer that question.

The "Super Pin..." stamping shows up sometime around 1930. The 1908 Yale catalog suggests the top of the lock in this series was blank with a numbered keyway or the word "YALE" on the keyway (numbered keyways seem to show up randomly in the later build styles of this series). In 1917, a blank top and an unmarked keyway; the 1921 catalog suggests the tops of the padlocks contained stamped text. Sometime from 1925-1929, Yale started adding stamped text to the shackle (but then well into the '30s & '40s some years have plain shackles).

So for a number of the early years (10-15?), this series had a blank top. If the "Patent..." stamping represents the earliest variation, it would seem that they were produced prior to 1908 (the other choice would be around 1921 it seems). The Yale paracentric key with the "Y&T" trefoil on the reverse side of the bow was phased out by Yale by 1915 or earlier.

Does anyone happen to have a photo of a Yale 800 series padlock that has an original key with it that they could share?

Thanks to all for the additional information.

Tom
16-07-19, 01:31 PM
Iowa Tom L

Yale 800 Series Padlocks with Patent Dates Stamped the Top

"Does anyone happen to have a photo of a Yale 800 series padlock that has an original key with it that they could share?"

That should have read: "Does anyone happen to have a photo of a Yale 800 series padlock with the "Patented..." stamp on top that has an original key with it that they could share?"

Tom
16-07-19, 05:24 PM
Pschiffe

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iowa Tom L

"Does anyone happen to have a photo of a Yale 800 series padlock that has an original key with it that they could share?"

That should have read: "Does anyone happen to have a photo of a Yale 800 series padlock with the "Patented..." stamp on top that has an original key with it that they could share?"
Tom

The thumbnail attached titled "Additional Notes On The Yale 800 Series" was taken from page 125 of The National Locksmith Guide to Antique Padlocks (c) 1990 by Jack Roberts and may be of interest. It notes initial production dates of Nos. 830, 840, 850, 870, 872 and 937.

Pete Schifferli
16-07-19, 08:38 PM
Timothy

Yale & Towne Cast Bronze Pin-tumbler Padlocks - 800 Series Models - Manufacture Date

Look like Pete just get the answer. I remember reading that and I think i have the book somewhere at home. I do know there was someone came up with of what you talking about just don't remember where....Timothy....
17-07-19, 12:35 AM
Iowa Tom L

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pschiffe

The thumbnail attached titled "Additional Notes On The Yale 800 Series" was taken from page 125 of The National Locksmith Guide to Antique Padlocks (c) 1990 by Jack Roberts and may be of interest. It notes initial production dates of Nos. 830, 840, 850, 870, 872 and 937.

Pete Schifferli

Thank you Pete for the information and citation, I appreciate it. That gives me a place to start to investigate from and also nails down the year when the "Super Pin..." stamping began.

If someone has a photo of an 800 Series padlock with the "Patented..." stamping & an original key, I would still be interested seeing it posted.

It seems by 1908, Yale had changed the sizing of the 800 Series with 830 - 1.5", 840 - 1.75", 850 - 2", & 870 - 2.5".

Tom
17-07-19, 01:51 AM
YALE7750

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iowa Tom L

Thank you Pete for the information and citation, I appreciate it. That gives me a place to start to investigate from and also nails down the year when the "Super Pin..." stamping began.

If someone has a photo of an 800 Series padlock with the "Patented..." stamping & an original key, I would still be interested seeing it posted.

It seems by 1908, Yale had changed the sizing of the 800 Series with 830 - 1.5", 840 - 1.75", 850 - 2", & 870 - 2.5".

Tom

Unfortunately I don’t have the original key for the example I have—my best guess would be that it came with the round headed “Yale Paracentric” key with the Y&T logo & patent dates on the blade of the key. This design was replaced in the early 1900’s (one source I remember put it around 1904 or so) with one that had the YALE logo surrounded by a border & “SECURITY” stamped on the key blade. By the mid 20’s, keys were plainer—there was no longer a border around YALE & nothing on the key blade.
17-07-19, 08:59 PM
Pschiffe

Quote:

Originally Posted by YALE7750

Unfortunately I don’t have the original key for the example I have—my best guess would be that it came with the round headed “Yale Paracentric” key with the Y&T logo & patent dates on the blade of the key. This design was replaced in the early 1900’s (one source I remember put it around 1904 or so) with one that had the YALE logo surrounded by a border & “SECURITY” stamped on the key blade. By the mid 20’s, keys were plainer—there was no longer a border around YALE & nothing on the key blade.

See image here from Supplee Hardware Co. catalog ca. 1902 which illustrates some paracentric Yale key blanks from the era:
http://www.antique-locks.com/attachm...chmentid=12252

Pete Schifferli
18-07-19, 02:27 AM
Iowa Tom L

2 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pschiffe

See image here from Supplee Hardware Co. catalog ca. 1902 which illustrates some paracentric Yale key blanks from the era:
http://www.antique-locks.com/attachm...chmentid=12252

Pete Schifferli

Thank you Pete, I appreciate the ad image. In my investigations on this site and others, along with searching out Yale ads; here is what I have been able to assemble on Yale keys for the 800 series.

The Yale Paracentric style key was patented on December 13, 1898 (US29786), I do not know when it went into production. Obviously, at least by 1902 as the image you posted indicates. Initially, the blade of the key contained patent dates and, on the reverse side of the bow, it had "Y & T Trade Mark" inside a trefoil outline.

By 1908 at least, the key bow maintained the same design but now "Security" was stamped on the blade (see attached images, key on the right).

The "Y&T" ceased to be the Yale trademark in 1909 and was gradually phased out; the 800 series padlock itself, retained it until about 1925. However, by 1915, the "Y&T" trefoil and "Yale Paracentric" had been phased out from the key bow (maybe someone can nail this date down better than me?). It was replaced by "YALE" with a plaque outline (see the attached images, key on the left) with "Security" stamped on the blade. This key design was in use from approximately 1915 – 1926 (again, maybe someone here might be able to provide more definitive dates?).

Around 1927, plaque outline was dropped and the Yale key design displayed “YALE” in uppercase, block letters without any outline. This key design was maintained through approximately 1971, after which “Yale” was displayed in uppercase and lowercase letters without a border.

So a Yale 800 Series lock with an original key would help establish the build date and it may even be associated with two original key designs. Did the Yale locks in this series start production with the "Patented..." stamp, or was it added later for a period of time? I know that Yale was producing this series with the "Patented..." stamp sometime after 1905; but did they begin production with the stamp?

Thanks to all of you for sharing your knowledge with me.

Tom
18-07-19, 02:08 PM
Timothy

1 Attachment(s)

Yale & Towne Cast Bronze Pin-tumbler Padlocks - 800 Series Models - Manufacture Date

Here is Design patent number key from Yale 1898. There could be more but this it the only one i found so from.....Timothy.....
18-07-19, 04:11 PM
Pschiffe

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timothy

Here is Design patent number key from Yale 1898. There could be more but this it the only one i found so from.....Timothy.....

From 150 Years of Builders' Hardware (c) 1993 by Maud L. Eastwood, pg. 44:
...by 1904 all Yale cylinder locks had the new paracentric keys with a new bow design and were made of nickel bronze with gold plate.
See thumbnail of vintage Yale No. 8 blank taken from my earlier post from Supplee Hardware Co. catalog ca. 1902.

Pete Schifferli
18-07-19, 05:41 PM
Huw Eastwood

2 Attachment(s)

Had these knocking around as long as I can remember but sadly no matching padlocks.
Attachment 21548 Attachment 21549
21-07-19, 03:24 PM
candado3

Came across the following statement

"The original Flat key of Mr. Yale was superseded about 1882 by the improved Corrugated key, shown by Fig. 2, and this in turn, about 1892, by the still better "Paracentric" key now used with all genuine Yale Locks and shown by Fig. 3 on next page"

From the following website - http://www.erbutler.com/pdf/research/reference/towne-1904-locks_and_builders_hardware.pdf

Hope it is of some help to someone
21-07-19, 09:12 PM
Pschiffe

3 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by candado3

Came across the following statement

"The original Flat key of Mr. Yale was superseded about 1882 by the improved Corrugated key, shown by Fig. 2, and this in turn, about 1892, by the still better "Paracentric" key now used with all genuine Yale Locks and shown by Fig. 3 on next page"
From the following website - http://www.erbutler.com/pdf/research/reference/towne-1904-locks_and_builders_hardware.pdf
Hope it is of some help to someone

The original flat Yale cylinder lock key was in use from 1868-1877 (Fig. 7), the corrugated version (Fig. 8) from 1878-1892 and the paracentric (Fig. 9) from 1892 forward.*
*adapted from Been There, Done That!, memoir of Billy B. Edwards Jr. (c) 2014, pg. 72
See thumbnail images below taken from Yale Catalog No. 26 (c) 1929, pg. XXXI

Pete Schifferli